tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post113123061170198158..comments2024-01-01T05:14:46.672-05:00Comments on Double Articulation: On Multiplicity: The Pleasures and Politics of Infinite Crises on Infinite EarthsJim Roeghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16381244745309535742noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1132822368544391042005-11-24T03:52:00.000-05:002005-11-24T03:52:00.000-05:00I think it's worth mention that IC#2 acknowledge t...I think it's worth mention that IC#2 acknowledge the collonial aspects of the multiverse when Kal-L tells Power Girl that "We let them [Earth-1 heroes] call us earth-2 even tough we came first" (in some ways the "plot-hole" of Kal-L claiming E-1 was the template for the new earth, something that never truly happens in the plot of Wolfman/Perez's Crisis but we all know be actually truth for editorial reasons, actually works in this direction too).<BR/><BR/>BTW, great essay.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1132183475703580092005-11-16T18:24:00.000-05:002005-11-16T18:24:00.000-05:00Actually, it's your final point there that was the...Actually, it's your final point there that was the most illuminating for me. I knew it was coming intellectually, but it only just "clicked" that, in the coming months, we'll be seeing Geoff Johns and Grant Morrison conducting a tug-of-war over the future of the DC Universe. That does indeed sound REALLY interesting and fun.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1132102410962203742005-11-15T19:53:00.000-05:002005-11-15T19:53:00.000-05:00Thanks, Mark (with a "k")! And for sure, give the...Thanks, <B>Mark (with a "k")</B>! And for sure, give the actual series a try. The lead-up material (including that patched together Countdown "Special") was of mixed quality to be sure, but <I>Infinite Crisis</I> itself (regardless of how it turns out) is definitely an exciting read!<BR/><BR/><B>Marc ("Not the Beastmaster," Marc)</B> - You made my day! I was delighted to discover your essay just a few hours ago when browsing my referers and have been mentally working on a response to your response ever since! Your piece very eloquently sets forth precisely the set of issues that I'm constantly chasing round in my own head, and my sense is that our positions are not all that far apart. (Despite evidence to the contrary in my essay, I am in total agreement with you about the dangers of "multiplicity for its own sake." I'll save my thoughts on this, though, for a more worked out reply, which should hopefully be up by week's end, if not sooner.) Again, thanks for the (immanent) critique--everyone should be so lucky as to have responses like this! (Anyone who has not yet read Marc's essay at the link above...what are you waiting for??)Jim Roeghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16381244745309535742noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1132097207413847842005-11-15T18:26:00.000-05:002005-11-15T18:26:00.000-05:00Great essay (and comments thread). Like Mark, I'm...Great essay (and comments thread). Like Mark, I'm a little skeptical that the old DC multiverse was inherently progressive or diverse--but I found I had so much to write on this subject, I ended up setting my thoughts down <A HREF="http://notthebeastmaster.typepad.com/weblog/2005/11/jim_roeg_has_an.html" REL="nofollow">here</A>.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1131834723806334752005-11-12T17:32:00.000-05:002005-11-12T17:32:00.000-05:00Really nice piece. At this rate, I may have to buy...Really nice piece. At this rate, I may have to buy this series, something I swore not to after the schlocky COUNTDOWN TO... issue.Mark Kardwellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17791352096505994671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1131727826680866412005-11-11T11:50:00.000-05:002005-11-11T11:50:00.000-05:00robb: You're welcome! It's a great interview, and...<B>robb</B>: You're welcome! It's a great interview, and what a terrific series! I'm looking forward to the subsequent books (though this may only happen in some future or alternate lifetime). A multiverse would solve a lot of my problems with time and sleep.<BR/><BR/><B>Jon</B>: good to hear from you! Re: <I>It's also kind of neat that the multi-verse was too hard to keep track of, now continuity is too unweildy and everyone is aching for the freedom of "doing what they want with the characters"</I>--so true! the added irony is that with Johns at the helm, continuity isn't sacrificed so much as synthesized: the multiverse might really turn out to be "the best of all possible worlds" (literally!)--creative freedom + continuity...<BR/><BR/><B>Zack</B>: We are legion!<BR/><BR/><B>Mark</B>: I am going to (almost) resist interpreting the quest for the elusive quotation as symbolic of the equally elusive quest for achieved postcolonial multiplicity...! :)Jim Roeghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16381244745309535742noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1131496686709876312005-11-08T19:38:00.000-05:002005-11-08T19:38:00.000-05:00Jim -I've spent the day tying to track down a quot...Jim -<BR/><BR/>I've spent the day tying to track down a quote. I give up. <BR/><BR/>I remember one of the Crisis architects (I think <I>Waid</I>) said something like "it's almost as if they each were in their own universe, isn't it?"<BR/><BR/>Now <I>that</I> would be the postcolonial multiverse you see. If we had a multiplicity of genre and character that was all of equal weight.Mark Fossenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03623615263972844957noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1131492260122078162005-11-08T18:24:00.000-05:002005-11-08T18:24:00.000-05:00You and I had very similar childhoods.You and I had very similar childhoods.zack sotohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05316613980695547614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1131486363601127902005-11-08T16:46:00.000-05:002005-11-08T16:46:00.000-05:00Good to have you back Jim. Fantastic post, again....Good to have you back Jim. Fantastic post, again. It's got me excited for tomorrow. This really is a great example of postmodern comics. It introduces the possibility for many options that are all more or less the same anyway. Does it matter which cola you drink, it's all cola?<BR/><BR/>Right now the term "new status quo" makes me chuckle. If it's new, it can't be status quo. You can have new boundaries or parameters in which to operate, but status quo is organic and involves a process occuring over time.<BR/><BR/>It's also kind of neat that the multi-verse was too hard to keep track of, now continuity is too unweildy and everyone is aching for the freedom of "doing what they want with the characters."joncormierhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00865627865285684437noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1131454699177055312005-11-08T07:58:00.000-05:002005-11-08T07:58:00.000-05:00Great essay Jim! I am really interested to see the...Great essay Jim! I am really interested to see the status Quo of the DCU after this event. I also though <I>Villains United</I> was a lot of fun.<BR/><BR/>I was moreso writing about one of your sidebar links, specifically Bakker's <I>The Darkness that Comes Before</I> - Thanks for linking to my (sffworld) interview with him. <BR/><BR/>I hope you are enjoying the book, I just finsihed the final book in the trilogy - <I>The Thousandfold Thought</I> last week and I was blown away.RobBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04014122096561992311noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1131419527072634002005-11-07T22:12:00.000-05:002005-11-07T22:12:00.000-05:00Scott--thanks for the high praise and thanks also ...<B>Scott</B>--thanks for the high praise and thanks also for commenting. Despite my quibbles I'm really excited about <I>IC</I> too. In fact, I haven't been this geeked out about an event for awhile, and that's saying something. I can't wait for Wednesday!<BR/><BR/>Hi <B>Mark</B>,<BR/>Re: <I>It seems that the old multiverse was, in fact, highly representative of colonial thought. It acknowledged diversity, but only as it served the Superpower (Britian, USA, or Earth-1). Only a multiverse where all realities have equal weight in the narrative would be truly postcolonial. </I><BR/><BR/>Agreed, agreed--and very well put (I shamefacedly admit that my musing on this point was sloppy). You're right that the old multiverse gives us, in effect, a colonial version of difference that is always another version of "the same." The most I could legitimately claim about that part of the argument is that the original multiverse figures a "gestural" multiplicity that is compromised in precisely the way you describe. Would a new multiverse simply restore such a system of pseudomultiplicity? Probably. My suspicion is that American superhero comics can't really represent the type of "full" multiplicity that many of us would like to see--at least not in terms of a cosmic/geographical allegory (i.e. Earth-2 as a cipher for the so-called Third World, or something). The inevitable failure of representing genuine multiplicity (or pluralism) on the level of a multiverse allegory in an America-centered comics universe, however, might not be the end of the story.<BR/><BR/>I've clearly collapsed a number of very complicated issues into a sort of homeostatic blob in that sentence you cited (anti-humanism, postmodern ethics, postcolonialism) and certainly these terms describe several notions whose doubtful compatibility is the source of many arguments (eg. both postmodernism and postcolonialism offer a critique of the unity and self-presence of the Western subject, but not on the same basis, and not to the same ends, or rather, there are areas of overlap between both, but also significant areas of difference). The argument I had in mind (but was too lazy too work out properly) is that although the (new, projected) multiverese might necessarily "fail" as an allegory of multiplicity that would "cherish uniqueness," the movement out of singularity towards contradiction <I>within</I> what remains a "Western" or "American" form of self-reflection (i.e. the Justice League) is not just "a step in the right direction" (a weak but necessary argument) but more importantly a subversion on the ideological "unity" that this self/nation projects. In short, I'm really arguing that the issue of the multiverse (which may, after all, not even be reintroduced per se, especialy given Johns's love of synthesis!)is only one of the ways in which the current <I>Crisis</I> could be read as (almost) politically progressive. <BR/><BR/>My highly qualified defense of the politics of <I>Crisis</I> (at least so far) is that even if it fails to provide a "positive" image of multiplicity (because its form as an American superhero comic makes that nearly impossible--how could Uncle Sam ever symbolize alterity?) its turn towards fragmentation and contradition within at least provides a "negative" critique of singularity (which I see as having affinities with antihumanism and postmodernism--though maybe you're right that "postcolonialism" is taking things too far). I would even be almost willing to see things like the sort of fake-multiplicity of "Infinite Earths" as a "weak" version of real multiplicity that is struggling to emerge from a genre that is formally arrayed against its possible emergence (i.e. Power Girl's "impossible" presence might <I>almost</I> be read as a symptom of a repressed multiplicity that is coming into representation, but can't do so in a "genuine" form because the codes of text--"American superheroes"--are intrinsicaly limiting). Or maybe I've just been reading too much Fredric Jameson.<BR/><BR/>At any rate, I'm speculating that the book as embodies some fairly radical contradictions! To weasle out of this, let me say simply that it's too soon to tell! :)Jim Roeghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16381244745309535742noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13604760.post-1131394289947536112005-11-07T15:11:00.000-05:002005-11-07T15:11:00.000-05:00So many things come to mind, but I'll start here:"...So many things come to mind, but I'll start here:<BR/><I>"symbolization of the critique of unity and identity that in some quarters is called anti-humanism, in others postmodern ethics, and in still others postcoloniality"</I><BR/>Who knows where Johns is going for sure. But let's say he <I>will</I> restore the multiverse. The problem with interpreting the DC Multiverse as postcolonial thought is that multiplicity is not cherished as unique. There was always one "real" world - Earth-1 - and various "lesser" worlds. The multiverse was always viewed through the prism of Earth-1, and defined only in contrast to the "real" DCU. <BR/><BR/>It seems that the old multiverse was, in fact, highly representative of colonial thought. It acknowledged diversity, but only as it served the Superpower (Britian, USA, or Earth-1). Only a multiverse where all realities have equal weight in the narrative would be truly postcolonial.Mark Fossenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03623615263972844957noreply@blogger.com